INTERVIEW: The Orielles

Having been a massive fan of Manchester based Sid, Esmé and Henry – aka The Orielles – since first hearing them nearly a decade ago, it’s been wonderful to see them go from strength to strength over the years and continue to create truly unique offerings. Now, following a number of albums, headline tours and even ventures into scoring and directing their own film (La Vita Olistica, 2021), they have released an experimental new collection – an innovative re-working of last year’s Tableau, The Goyt Method showcases the trio’s insightful and sophisticated songwriting, and ability to create exquisite, avant-garde soundscapes.

Following the EP’s release and ahead of catching them at Higher Ground Festival (a one day event at The Roundhouse on 15th July, with an all female line-up), I caught up with Esmé and Sid to find out more about The Goyt Method, their recent tour and their thoughts on being women in the music industry… Have a read!

Hi folks, so nice to meet you – been a fan for a long time! How are you doing at the moment? And what does the weekend have in store? 

Sid: We’ve just come off our European tour, so we’re now spending some time just enjoying home comforts for a bit, catching up with friends and things. We’ve also got a new practice space, so going to be jamming in there, and taking it easy for a few weeks. 

And how was the European tour for you?

Esmé: It was so amazing to play in cities we’ve not been to in years – I think we toured Silver Dollar Moment in a small handful of European cities, but then didn’t get the chance to with Disco Volador, so going back to places like Paris, and probably having one of the best crowds we had throughout the whole of the UK, American and European shows, was really nice to see. It was also really heartwarming to meet a lot of the people who’ve been waiting to see us for quite a while.
Sid: It was really cool as well because, as Es mentioned, we’d not played in Europe for such a long time that when we went out there and we were playing mostly new material, it was nice to see the fans really reacting more to that. In England, when we play, the fans tend to just want ‘the hits’, like singles from previous releases, whereas this time people were really appreciative of actual record stuff, which was dead nice, and obviously something that we’d hoped for – on this tour in particular – as our latest material is quite a step away from older stuff, so it was nice to see people were really enjoying it. 

Is your live set up quite different now that you’re playing newer material? 

Esmé: We still play with Emily Zurowski on keys – she’s a session player, and has her own projects going on, and brings something really different and interesting to the shows – a more synthy / dancey feel. And we as a band are now more leaning towards that synth-heavy side of things, with a lot of the vocals being triggered through samples and that kind of thing. Generally, I’d say the shows now have more room for experimentation than they used to. 

And, when you’re out on tour, do you have any particular essentials that you always take to keep you going while away from home?

Sid: I don’t really have many essentials as such, but I do always need my headphones! I enjoy watching a lot of films, and I’ve got Mubi logged in on my phone, so – if we have a long drive – being able to watch a film makes me feel at home. I can then chat to my friends about it and make recommendations to them! At the moment, I’ve been really into and watching a lot of Wong Kar-Wai films and really love all of those I’ve seen – most recently ‘Happy Together’, which I watched for the first time a couple of weeks ago and really really loved! I really love his visual style – the cinematography’s really great. 
Also, on the last tour we all said we were going to take our yoga mats and make time to do that every day, but it just never happened! You always think you have so much time, but you just don’t. It would be good to get to the point where everything was set up for us and we had a few hours to do some yoga, but we just don’t. 
Esmé: I like to take a good selection of books as well. Though the down time doesn’t come around every day, when you do get a day off and get the opportunity to just sit there with a book, it’s really nice – a nice mindful thing to do. I’ve just started a really big book that I don’t think I’ll be finishing too quickly – it’s called ‘Unsound:Undead’, and it’s a collection of short essays about different approaches of sound that come from sources that aren’t living. Lots of the essays I’m reading are about bodily sounds, or the sounds of disease. And then they also talk about things like the sounds of an atomic bomb or those kinds of sounds that are lesser explored. 

Talking of different and interesting sounds…. You have a new EP The Goyt Method out now via Heavenly Records, which is super exciting! It sounds like there’s some really interesting concepts behind it – are you able to explain a bit about its inspirations and the process of recording it?

Esmé: Yeah, I guess it does link to what I’m reading about. We kind of zoomed out of the record (last year’s Tableau), looked at all of the stems across it and then used a random wheel of fortune to allocate which stems we were going to put back together and create a new song from. And part of that lead us to discover some of the smaller sounds that weren’t necessarily lead hooks or significant parts in the record – so, we took them and expanded them to become the main sound that you hear in these new tracks on The Goyt Method.
Sid: Yeah, when we were recording Tableau, we were really into the idea of randomisation , things like cybernetics and AI within music and how, through this wheel of fortune idea, a song could be done in so many different ways. And it was within these limitations that we were given a new drawing board to work with, and it really pushed us to think of new ways to arrange these melodies to make completely different versions of the songs. That idea really excited us because we wanted to give Tableau a new lease of life. Through making new arrangements of the songs, it was different from just remixing them in a traditional sense. 
Esmé: It definitely speaks to our practice as musicians now and a realisation that we’ve come to since writing Tableau – we’re now less precious about writing a collection of ten songs that we’d demoed and thought about for a year, and then put on an album and then have to move onto the next thing. We like the idea that every song can exist in so many diferent ways, can be played slightly wrong and that still might be the version we go with because it has more feel in it – I guess we’re trying to move away from the idea that everything has to be so final. We’re now more into leaving everything open ended with the chance that it can be worked on and changed to create something different. 
Sid: Yeah, when we first started working with Joel (Patchett) who helped us produce the record, we were recording at a place called Goyt Mill which is in a place called Goyt… And we first came up with the term ‘to goyt’ something – our own way of describing to Joel what we wanted him to do with a particular sound. So, ‘goyting’ something is changing its form in a way that’s random and in a way that a computer might change things – it’s quite complex!
Esmé: It links to the ‘musique concrète’ kind of vibe – the way of making a sound seem completely separate from what it originally sounded like. Or using a sound source that we can modify – often turning raw sounds into something more electronic sounding. 
Sid: Hence the title, The Goyt Method

And was it quite a big team helping you create the record? Or was it just the three of you with Joel?

Esmé: Yeah, it was just the four of us throughout the whole process. The same as Tableau. We were given the freedom to do it that way which was really helpful for us – to be in that creative headspace and work so closely together, just the four of us. A lot of it was just recorded in my bedroom, or at Joel’s house. Just setting up DIY / impromptu spots to capture everything. 
Sid: Yeah, it was a really interesting process reworking all the tracks. Particularly with certain songs – like on Tableau there’s ‘Improvisation 001’and on Goyt Method there’s ‘Improvisation 002’, which is basically just the strings take – we asked the musicians to come back and improvise completely along to the original track, to just feel their way through and not worry about messing up. And we really liked how that sounded as a standalone piece, so put the whole piece of music on as its own track on The Goyt Method
Esmé: I actually heard that in full on NTS the other day – sounded so nice, it’s really beautiful! 

Obviously this EP, and Tableau, seem very different in sound from your earlier releases – can you explain a bit about what inspired you to make this change of direction?

Esmé: It was partly just being given the freedom to do it. It’s always been within us to make this kind of album – so much so that weirdly, to us, it almost feels like a first album again. I think in the past we just maybe didn’t understand that there were different ways of approaching creating an album. As proud as we are of our previous albums, it was very much following the structure of making a demo, then being asked for three singles at least… So, the different sound I think almost came as part of changing the process. 
Sid: And we were listening to a lot more experimental music as well and getting more into electronic music than we had been before. This definitely influenced the process and the outcome a lot.
Esmé: We were also doing our Soho Radio vinyl mixes – we would meet every month and record a two hour mix. This meant we were buying a lot more records for ourselves which lead to a lot more exploration into music – we were holding these records and discussing them with each other, and we really wanted people to have something that they could see as an album that was valued; something to own physically and to discuss. Something that you would have to listen to from start to finish.
Sid: That’s what I was going to say! 

You’ve mentioned about remixing music – and I know that, as well as being an amazing band yourselves, you’ve also remixed songs by some other amazing bands like Peaness and PINS. How do you normally go about remixing other bands’ tracks, and how do the collaborations normally come about?

Sid: Yeah, I feel that it goes quite nicely hand in hand with The Goyt Method. Although we were doing remixing well before we thought about the album, we use very similar techniques and a way of working – finding stems and ‘goyting’ them. Adding new textures. And remixing is something that we’ve always enjoyed doing and inspires a lot of our songwriting. The Peaness one in particular was definitely a favourite – we went a bit wild with it. I remember when we first pitched up the vocals and sped it up we were all in Joel’s apartment, just loving it! *fist pumps* 
Esmé: I think as well when we did the La Vita Olistica film, we realised that editing a film can be quite similar to stepping back and pulling a song apart and piecing it together in different ways. We’ve always been fond of editing as an art or medium, and the way you can create new meanings from things – how you put two things together can be so hugely significant. With remixing we’ve followed that ethos like we’re kind of editors or a film or something. 

With the film side of things is that something you would like to do more of – create more visual accompaniments to your music? 

Esmé: Yeah, I think we’ve definitely realised that it’s all hugely interlinked – our music with visual media, like film or art, like the album covers and stuff. We have really enjoyed making short videos for some of the tracks on Tableau (I think, rather ambitiously, we did intend on creating a video for every single track at the start…) But I think we’d love to do another ten or twenty minute short film to incorporate a few of the tracks from the album together. 

I’m very much looking forward to seeing you live at Higher Ground Festival in July! You’ve touched a bit on how your live set up has now changed – what can we expect at this show? 

Sid: Yeah, I think we will be playing with some of the strings players for this one at Higher Ground. Just because it’s such an epic venue, The Roundhouse. We feel bad about the last London show getting cancelled (at Earth, when we had just done the one at Stoller Hall in Manchester), so we obviously had to rearrange that, and it seems a perfect location to add the strings, which will be really exciting. And I think we’ll bring some different elements of Tableau into the live set too, and play more of a tailored set around the strings. And, although we’d love to do this consistently, I think keeping it for like special one-offs like ths one is a nice thing to do. 

You mentioned about Paris on the last tour being particularly special, and I’ve been lucky enough to see you live a few times – from Green Man festival to headlining The Garage in North London (though I think the first time may have been at The Victoria supporting The Parrots… ?). But has there been a particular gig you’ve played over the years that stands out as a particular highlight for you?

Esmé: When we played the Stoller Hall show I remember saying at the time that it was up there with our top three gigs. Obviously, partly because it was such an amazing set up; we’d never really played to a seated crowd before, and it very much felt like being in a weird David Lynch film, and we all leaned into it, and it was quite a surreal experience! But I don’t know if that’s also because it was our first time playing a lot of Tableau to an audience as well. To be honest, on the tour we’ve just been on there were consistently a lot of favourites, most nights!
The one in Texas as well. We had a show that was cut short, because there was a really ominous thunder storm about to happen, and we were able to play about four songs before it had to be called off. We didn’t realise until afterwards, when everyone showed us videos, that the lightening in the background was moving in syncopation with a lot of the synths – it was just such an epic backdrop to be playing against before the heavens opened. 
Sid: I think we played that particular show with such a weird kind of unique energy where, because it had been such a hot, muggy day (and with this rainstorm looming, and we were a little bit jet-lagged), there was this tension, and we ended up playing really really well. We’d been told that our set was going to be cut short, so we kind of sped through it – it was really punky with loads of energy. We just bashed through the songs, then as soon as we’d finished, this torrential downpour started, and it was so cathartic. 

As we’re an organisation promoting and supporting women and the LGBTQ+ community in music, I just wondered what your thoughts were about the industry today in this respect – how do you feel it is for marginalised groups at the moment, and do you feel much has changed over the last few years in its treatment of female/queer artists?

Esmé: Yeah, the industry’s definitely a tough place for any woman. I mean, most industries are unfortunately! But I think it’s quite heightened in one where expectations around image and how you behave are always prevalent. I think I would say that – although it’s not disappeared, and it’s probably something I’ve hardened myself to – it’s harder as a younger woman. You seem to have to have loads of albums out to gain respect, and to prove yourself a lot more, so lately I’ve not experienced it as much. But definitely when we were both younger there was a lot more difficulty in being taken seriously. I feel like it wasn’t until Sid was about 27 that people stopped calling us teenagers, which was quite belittling… 
Sid: Yeah, I agree. I can’t think of anything we’ve experienced in recent years, which – as Es says, may just be because we’ve hardened to it a bit. But I do think it’s mainly because people seem to give you a lot more respect when you have albums to show, or people just realising you’re actually good. When you’re starting out and you’re younger, and not in the position of being a signed band (and don’t have a ‘team’ behind you), I think that’s when it can be really difficult. And I think that a lot of guys in bands that are starting out are forgiven for being ‘punk’ and lairy – they can scream down a mic and get away with it. Whereas I think when women do something similar it’s seen as being really rubbish, or because we can’t play our instruments or can’t sing in tune. All of a sudden you get some sort of recognition and that seems to go away. It’s a shame that you have to be in that position of having support in order to get recognised or respected. 
Esmé: I would also say that, probably subconsciously, this kind of thing is what might have sparked our leaning towards the more experimental or electronic scenes. I’m not saying sexism is absent from these scenes, but it seems a lot more female heavy and to include a lot more people of colour – it’s a better space for musicians to be diverse and for everyone to be respected and taken seriously. Venues like The White Hotel in Manchester are a great example of this – it’s one of the most diverse venues I can think of in terms of their representation of artists, compared to other venues or more ‘indie’ festival line-ups that are so male dominated, where mostly like just four lads in a band seem to take up most of the space. 

Massive thanks to Esmé and Sid for taking the time to speak to me, and answering my questions! 

The Goyt Method, the innovative new EP from The Orielles, is out now via Heavenly Records. Order here. And catch them live at a number of dates over the next couple of months, including Higher Ground Festival, at The Roundhouse on 15th July. 

Five Favourites: SOFTEE

Having just released her debut album, Brooklyn based artist Nina Grollman – aka Softee – creates sparkling alt-pop soundscapes with a stirring, heartfelt emotion. Oozing a glistening immersive splendour throughout, Natural explores complex themes of identity and transformation with a soulful, uplifting energy.

We think one of the best ways to get to know an artist is by asking what music inspires them. So, to celebrate the release of Natural, we caught up with Softee to ask about the music that has inspired her the most. So, read about her five favourite songs, and make sure you check out the album, and watch the beaut new video for latest single ‘Isn’t Enough‘ below...

Stevie Wonder – ‘Summer Soft’
The first time I heard this track, I was nine years old. My mom played it in the car. I was so into all the key changes and the build of the song. I’m obsessed with Stevie’s voice. As I grew up, my appreciation for the song deepened. For years I thought he was singing about a past relationship. When I finally looked up the lyrics, I realized it’s about the seasons, and aging. It makes me so emotional when I hear it now, because it’s so full of passion and fervour, and it’s about getting older and time slipping by. The dichotomy of these two concepts is so rich. Stevie can truly write about everything and make it timeless.

Charlie XCX – ‘Sucker’
Let me explain. I know this isn’t Charli’s best song, but it’s extremely important to me. The year is 2014, and one of my best friends had an extra ticket to the Bleachers concert in Minneapolis. Charli was co-headlining the show, but I had no idea who she was. I barely even knew Jack Antonoff but I went cause duh, free ticket. Charli comes onstage in Adidas pants (BEFORE they were super trendy) and sports bra, with an inflatable guitar and sunglasses. She has an all girl band. She opens the set with ‘Sucker’. Something in me completely shifted. I was like “oh, THIS is a fucking POP star.” I didn’t know pop could be grunge??? For that album, she was influenced by the Shangri-Las and super cool underground ’90s pop. I was obsessed with her energy and the set brought me an adrenaline high I don’t think I’ve ever topped at a show. To this day I hear this song and I get butterflies.

Robyn – ‘With Every Heartbeat
I think my favourite Robyn song changes daily, but today it’s this one. The strings. The simplicity of the beat. This song completely hypnotises you while ripping your heart out of your chest. It’s hopeful while reckoning with the fact that the relationship is over. Robyn is a genius, and one of my biggest influences. I love how simple and powerful her songwriting is. She is endlessly innovative. Her chords and melodies make me want to cry.

La Roux – ‘Automatic Driver’
When this song came out I listened to it on loop for ages! It’s so danceable and fun. A perfect song to walk to on a sunny day when you’re in a good mood!

Little Dragon – ‘Another Lover’
This is me and my fiancé’s song. It’s so infectious, from the melody to the production, to Yakimi Nagano’s vocals, to the driving bassline. This song has it all. I’m a major Little Dragon fan. Their electronic-pop-rnb fusion is so singular to their sound. I am very inspired by it. 

Massive thanks to Softee for sharing her Five Favourites with us! Watch the video for latest single ‘Isn’t Enough’ here:

Natural, the debut album from Softee, is out now via City Slang.

INTERVIEW: Lucy O’Brien on Karen Carpenter

Having been big fans of author and journalist Lucy O’Brien for some time now (Dusty: The Classic Biography, Skin: It Takes Blood and Guts), and even getting a mention in the revised edition of her incredible She Bop: A Definitive History Of Women In Music a couple of years back, we were excited to find out about her latest venture: a biography of one of the most iconic women in music of the 20th century – Karen Carpenter, forty years after her passing. An insightful reframing of the often perceived ‘tragic’ figure, Lead Sister offers a fresh perspective on the life of Karen Carpenter; whilst touching on the sadness of her story, placing a focus on her strength and innovative drive. 

After reading the book and attending its London launch at Soho’s Century Club a couple of months back, I was lucky enough to catch up with Lucy to find out more about what inspired her to write the book and what she discovered about Karen along the way… 

Primarily known both for her angelic voice and struggles with Anorexia Nervosa, Karen Carpenter was so much more than merely the delicate front woman we’re so often presented with; as O’Brien points out – “No way she was just submissive – she was the driving force of the band… And it’s interesting to see this picture emerging of this forthright, pioneering woman.” As so often seems to be the case, Carpenter’s history seems to have been buried by the media’s perception of her and how a woman in the industry should be, and so it’s wonderful that O’Brien made it her mission with Lead Sister to reframe this existing narrative: “It was time to revisit her story and look at it through a new lens. Not only the eating disorder that she struggled with, but also how much she achieved despite that. Was she really just a submissive puppet? I doubt it. To achieve that level of success in the US music industry in the ‘70s, which is a hard place to be, I knew there had to be more to the story.” 

This uncovering of a subject’s narrative, finding new material and piecing the story together piece by piece is key in the job of biographer (“almost like a detective”), and something that O’Brien is no stranger to. Being able to cast a new light on stories told, taking into perspective the attitudes of the times and a deeper understanding of certain issues, is something she has done with previous books – revisiting her biography of Dusty Springfield in 2019, for example, she was able to explore the LGBTQ+ issues and Springfield’s sexuality more than she would have thirty years before for the original 1989 edition. Society’s attitudes shift, and so too do the voices we hear. Up until now we had only really heard one voice in the Karen Carpenter story – that of Richard – and O’Brien believed it was now time for that to change: “…. the story that emerges is the story of the people that want to contribute. Previous biographies, ones approved by family, tended to portray Karen as the victim – as someone with not much agency. What was great with this book, I was talking to people who hadn’t done many interviews before – giving a fresh perspective.”

Having briefly touched on Karen Carpenter’s story in She Bop, O’Brien jumped at the chance to focus on her story in more depth when Pete Selby (98 Books – Miki Berenyi, Jenniffer Otto) asked if she wanted to do a full biography: “I’ve always been fascinated by her and her amazing, fluid wonderful emotional voice. That juxtaposition of the perfect lush pop of The Carpenters and then the sadness within a lot of the music, and the lyrics.” One of the things that appealed to her the most was Karen’s strength of character and unrelenting energy for what she loved – like drumming. “When she joined the school marching band, that’s when things turned around for her and she found liberation through drumming. She used to go to a drum shop in LA where mostly male drummers would hang out. She would hang out with them and swap stories. She got her parents to buy her a drum kit. She had pictures of people like Buddy Guy on her bedroom wall at the age of 15. She had a vision. She was such a committed drummer. Realising things like that – I realised she was quite a tough cookie.” 

This passion for what was (and still is in some respects) quite an usual instrument for a woman to play marks Karen Carpenter out as somewhat ahead of her time, as did her fierce drive and determination: “She was very competitive in terms of wanting to succeed. Talking to head of promotion at A&M, he was in awe of her encyclopaedic knowledge of the music industry and radio stations across the country.” So, certainly not just a submissive counter-part to her brother – in fact, from the stirring account of their childhood in Lead Sister, it often seems as though she was the ‘tough’ one in their relationship, frequently sticking up to his bullies at school, or being reprimanded for her cheeky sense of humour. O’Brien reflects on these more ‘masculine’ qualities of Karen when we speak; speculating that perhaps, had she been alive today, she may have identified as more gender-fluid as she did not fit into the conventional ‘feminine stereotype’ that was certainly prevalent at the time. 

However, despite her strength, she faced opposition to her love of drumming as The Carpenters started to achieve success, with huge pressure put on her from both Richard and other men on the team, to stop ‘hiding’ behind the kit – “this is such a contradiction in terms”, O’Brien responds, “how can you ‘hide’ behind drums – drums are the most expressive instrument. She was really expressing herself.” Sadly, though she resisted it for a long time, it seems that she lost the battle to be able to stay doing what she loved, and was almost ‘de-skilled’ by having to simply stand up front and sell the songs, “be a decorative front woman”. Understandably, this must have dented her confidence and been very frustrating for someone with such massive skill and passion – “… even though she had amazing voice, that wasn’t all there was to her…”, O’Brien explains, “… Every moment she could, she would find time to play the drums – like on their 1976 tour, she’d play an amazing drum solo right in the middle of concert.” (This tour is actually where the name of the book comes from, as – when the Carpenters toured Japan – a magazine mistakenly referred to her as the ‘lead sister’ of the band. She loved this title so much that she had it made into a t-shirt which she wore whilst thrashing out some beats at every opportunity on tour.) 

It was particularly heartwarming, then, for O’Brien this year, on the 40th anniversary of Karen’s passing, that a new emphasis seemed to be on her skill as a drummer: “That was what people were emphasising, much more than in the past when focus was always on her ‘silken’ voice – it’s really interesting how what we see and what we appreciate has shifted in terms of her expertise and what she symbolised.” 

The way in which Karen Carpenter struggled to fit into traditional ‘feminine’ roles is not a new perception. When speaking to some of her closest friends, O’Brien discovered how she had often found it difficult to fit in. Petula Clark, for example, reflected on Karen adjusting to the Beverly Hills culture, trying to turn herself into an “uptown Beverly Hills Queen” when that really wasn’t her; she was essentially just a musician’s musician, a “tom boy”. Remembering one particular instance, she told O’Brien of when she felt extremely uncomfortable seeing Karen feeling pressured to present herself in a certain way that wasn’t her true self, at a bridal shower she held at a country club with Beverly Hills socialites (before briefly marrying a real estate developer). Reflecting on how it seems that Karen wasn’t allowed to fully express herself and pursue what she was really passionate about, both in her professional and personal life, may go some way to explaining the root of her mental health struggles – “striving to become someone she wasn’t; someone that really wasn’t her.” 

However, looking back at Karen’s life, it’s clear that other factors could have played a part. When she was twelve, for example, the family moved from Connecticut to LA, primarily to help Richard with his career (“he was seen as the gifted musician”). Being uprooted at this age is bound to be difficult for anyone; especially as someone who been a straight A student, with lots of friends, keen on sports and very active, suddenly being moved to somewhere completely new where she did not know anyone. After they moved, Karen stopped playing sports and withdrew into herself, often binge eating and not feeling motivated to achieve (until she found marching band, and drumming later on). “All those facts were there”, O’Brien points out when reflecting on Karen’s struggles, “but no one thought to look at them and realise that it would been very traumatic…” 

O’Brien admits that it was difficult at times to delve into what Karen went through; from her somewhat dysfunctional upbringing and family relationships, to the later stages of her eating disorder – “it did become quite dark”, she reflects, “… it’s heart rending how much you realise she was struggling with it on her own. There wasn’t even a language for it – it was seen as slimming gone too far, and there nothing around to help… When it’s chronic, it is very hard. She did get to the chronic stage and she found it impossible even just looking in the mirror, the body dysmorphia was so strong.” 

Just listening to the Carpenters now, and what still seems to resonate so much, is how “you can hear the pain in her voice and the way she sings”; it’s deeply stirring, and O’Brien’s beautifully sensitive reflection immerses you in Karen’s story with a moving grace. Just reading the book, let alone having to research it, I have been deeply affected at times, and felt a strange, poignant connection to Karen Carpenter and what she went through; as O’Brien recalls George McKay (Skinny blues: Karen Carpenter, Anorexia Nervosa and Popular Music) telling her in one conversation – Karen really gets into your head. 

However, O’Brien tells me that speaking to those that knew Karen best, the light shone through; the strength of the person behind the public figure – “the more I could see the survivor in there, the pioneer.” One such person was Cherry Boone O’Neill, of the famous ‘70s sister pop group, The Boones. A close friend of Karen’s towards the end – and someone who had undergone similar experiences with a showbiz family, and also struggled with Anorexia herself -, she was able to offer a lot of insight and deeper understanding into the ‘real’ Karen. Having found a way through her illness, she was able to offer Karen a lot of advice; one of the key things she said to her when she was particularly struggling during the late ‘70s was that she should move away from LA, and from the industry – “Eating disorders are classed as addiction – so, you need to be away from the stress and circumstances that are creating this”, O’Brien explains, “… and, for Cherry, she had to move to Oregon, do intensive psychotherapy and take medication. It took a long time to recover, and she had to stop singing for a while.” However, for Karen, this was not option – she couldn’t stop singing, it was so important to her. In a way, it seems that her determination and unrelenting drive to get things done were ironically what prevented her from getting well herself – the feeling that there were a lot of people in the industry and family that were relying on her to keep everything going (especially whilst her brother Richard was in rehab).

Choosing not to take her friend’s advice, Karen went on to create her first solo album in 1979. Although, physically, she was deteriorating by this point, “I think she was just enjoying herself”, O’Brien reflects, “… she was nearly 30 and growing into an adult woman and wanted to explore the music of liberation at the time…” The recording of the album saw her delve into disco and soul with an array of incredible musicians (including Billy Joel’s backing band) – “Karen loved it. She was able to ditch that goody two shoes image that in America had seemed to hamper her reputation.” As a former boyfriend, Tom Bahler, joyfully reminisced with O’Brien, “she could certainly kick booty”. It seems poignantly bittersweet that Karen was able to finally express herself and find this cathartic joy through what she was creating so near the end, particularly thinking about what else she could have gone on to do; producer/arranger Bob James sharing with O’Brien that he really felt that she was on a journey and could have gone to have a great solo career. O’Brien is keen to highlight the enterprising and adventurous sense of spirit that shone through Karen even so near the end. With this album, for example, she travelled to New York and got herself a producer and some musicians, all in a very short space of time and independently: “That’s what I really enjoyed about her as I explored what she did and the people that she interacted with”, O’Brien reflects, “… the humour and strength that she approached things with.” Sadly, however, “it was the case with Karen that her spirit was willing, but the body was weak. By then, she just didn’t have the physical strength to push it through.” 

Although it is impossible to ignore the ‘darkness’ – the struggles she endured and the tragedy of Karen’s untimely passing – throughout Lead Sister what strikes you is this innovative artist’s effervescent, tenacious spirit, and it seems this spirit was present throughout the whole of O’Brien’s experience of researching and writing the book: “I did feel Karen was there, nudging me – almost assuring me, ‘that’s how I want people to remember me.’” A time when her presence seemed strongest was when O’Brien visited the studios where the Carpenters recorded their music (now Henson Studios) – “… there was this element of psycho geography that was quite transcendent.” The engineers, even now, still wish Karen goodnight at the end of every day. 

And it’s not just in those studios that Karen’s presence seems resonant today; people continue to be intrigued and inspired by her, whilst also – 40 years on – continuing to feel a striking sadness about her story. O’Brien speculates: “With Karen’s death, a bit like with Amy Winehouse, there was sense of collective failure, particularly within the music industry. With lots of people I interviewed, there seemed to be this feeling of collective failure and trauma – even after all these years, people are still asking why, wanting to ensure that something like that doesn’t happen again.” Thankfully, things have progressed somewhat in society’s understanding of eating disorders and the industry’s awareness of artists’ wellbeing today, and we can hope that this ensures its female subjects in particular are healthier and happier – “There’s a lot more awareness now within the industry, and within record companies in particular, about artists’ mental health and wellbeing, and making provision for that. It is now usually a part of management practice, and there is a whole discourse about how to look after artists, particularly female artists, and singers who may be vulnerable to eating disorders, given the relentless pressure to look ‘sexy’ or ‘glamorous’ to sell the music.”

However, had Karen still been physically with us today, O’Brien feels that she would have been a strong advocate for young women and non binary folk in the industry, helping to push things forwards for their wellbeing: “I think she would have been such a key figure. I can imagine her leading drumming workshops and being a mentor for young musicians. I can also imagine her being on panels – she was so engaged with so many things, and I think she had great business sense as well.” 

Finally, I ask O’Brien what she feels artists today could learn from Karen: “That passionate pursuit of what drives you”, she replies, “…to allow yourself to be completely immersed – utterly single minded in what you want to do. That joy in which Karen approached music. Even though it’s such a sad story, I just knew that when she was in studio, creating music, singing her heart out, she was happy. She was completely in herself.” Even in her short time with us, Karen Carpenter was able to create so much and become such an inspiration to others – she was determined, innovative, tenacious and courageous. And witty. All qualities which are highlighted beautifully throughout Lead Sister – a truly refreshing perspective on this well-known story, amplifying the voice of the person who matters the most, Karen. It truly allows her strengths to shine; to embolden others, and to leave a lasting imprint of her sparkling spirit: “… it’s like she’s here now”, O’Brien ponders, “… it’s as though she’s saying ‘Don’t remember me with sadness, just remember me with joy.’”

Lead Sister: The Story Of Karen Carpenter is out now via 98 Books. I strongly recommend getting yourself a copy of it here. Be prepared to feel the true presence of Karen with you throughout, thanks to O’Brien’s thorough research, compelling storytelling and empathetic reflection.

Mari Lane

PREMIERE: Charlotte Carpenter – ‘Spinning Plates’

Having charmed our ears as a guest on our radio show, and with 2017’s Shelter EP, East Midlands artist Charlotte Carpenter has previously shared stages with artists such as Marika Hackman and George Ezra. Now, having received acclaim from the likes of NME and BBC Radio 6Music, she has announced the release of her debut album later this year.

Taken from the album, new single ‘Spinning Plates’ offers a poignant reflection on the power structures and misogyny within the music industry. Propelled by a fierce energy, Carpenter’s gritty, raw vocals flow alongside catchy Americana-infused hooks. With a stirring sentiment that is all too relatable – lyrics such as “I’m just trying to be a better sister / daughter / lover…” highlighting how women’s worth is so often only seen as important within their relationship to men -, the track oozes an impassioned blues-soaked allure as it builds with a glistening, anthemic drive. A striking call to arms to fellow women and marginalised groups within the industry, ‘Spinning Plates’ offers a defiant return to form from this innovative artist, showcasing her ability to fuse together her trademark soulful musicality with a cathartic, empowering spirit.

Of the track, Carpenter explains:

There’s a lot to unpack in this songfrom societal pressures on the roles you are meant to fulfil as a woman, alongside the struggle of keeping up a relentless positivity to being a musician – and how impossible it is to ever get the balance between the two.”

Watch the new video for ‘Spinning Plates’ here:

‘Spinning Plates’ is set for release tomorrow, 17th May. Catch her live (supporting SOFT LAD and Kelli Blanchett):

14th July – The Finsbury, London 
27th July – The Victoria, Birmingham
28th July – Black Prince, Northampton
30th July – The Castle, Manchester 

Photo Credit: Fraser West